How do we respond to this political moment? Pessimism is tempting and optimism may feel foolhardy, yet a sense of possibility fueled by hope made enduring sense to us when we spoke with Lecia Brooks and Lisa Veneklasen in 2021. After the Biden/Harris victory, long-time activists Lecia and Lisa tapped into their wisdom and clear-eyed assessment of what we’re facing and what’s possible in the struggle for overdue and drastically needed social and political change. For the past 16 years, Lecia has worked at the well-known Southern Poverty Law Center, a regional and national catalyst for racial justice, most recently as Chief of Staff. She plays a key role in their work to expose and dismantle white supremacy and nationalism. Almost 20 years ago, Lisa founded Just Associates (JASS) and recently stepped down from her role as Executive Director. JASS is a transnational feminist movement building organization that strengthens the voice, visibility and collective power of women to transform the world. Lisa and Lecia’s analysis and insights about these times -- including the power of older women to make change happen -- galvanize and provoke us to think differently about this political moment. Learn more about this episode here!